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+--- Thread: A bit help needed (/thread-7119.html)
A bit help needed - niceguy123 - 12-19-2017
Hello hash cracking comrades
Looking to get a bit more info about a build I want to make. I want to make a hash cracking/ crypto mining rig.
The case will be open frame custom build and raisers will be used for maximum air flow etc. Thing is I want to put 10-12
ROG-STRIX-GTX1080TI-O11G-GAMING (https://www.asus.com/Graphics-Cards/ROG-STRIX-GTX1080TI-O11G-GAMING/).
So my main concern is the motherboard! Would it be better to use 2-3 motherboards and connect them like a cluster or use something like this: http://www.biostar.com.tw/app/en/news/news.php?S_ID=307
That baby has 12 GPU PCIE slots but the thing is that they are x1 and this is the part I am not sure of. I know that for mining this is OK but what about hash cracking? Would those PCIE slots be enough to get the full potential of those 1080Tis for hash cracking or I need x4 etc
RE: A bit help needed - niceguy123 - 12-20-2017
No one wants to share some knowledge? How important is the PCIe bus throughput for hash cracking? If I choose the motherboard with the single lane slot will my cracking speed results take a big hit?
RE: A bit help needed - walterlacka - 12-20-2017
I found this.. not sure it still applies:
https://hashcat.net/wiki/doku.php?id=frequently_asked_questions#does_the_pci-express_speed_have_any_influence_on_cracking_speed
RE: A bit help needed - Flomac - 12-21-2017
Maybe there're no answers cause it sounds like you have neither knowledge about rig building of that size nor hashcracking. No one is bulding a 20K rig for fun. You know what you're doing or you leave it to the pros.
That said, as you can read it everywhere here in the forum, this GPU would not be recommended since it is neither an FE-version nor does it have a radial fan.
About PCIE-speed: it depends, but usually it does not matter. If you want a more specific answer you need to give more specific informations like which kind of hashes you want to crack in which mode etc.
RE: A bit help needed - niceguy123 - 12-22-2017
(12-21-2017, 05:33 PM)Flomac Wrote: Maybe there're no answers cause it sounds like you have neither knowledge about rig building of that size nor hashcracking. No one is bulding a 20K rig for fun. You know what you're doing or you leave it to the pros.
That said, as you can read it everywhere here in the forum, this GPU would not be recommended since it is neither an FE-version nor does it have a radial fan.
About PCIE-speed: it depends, but usually it does not matter. If you want a more specific answer you need to give more specific informations like which kind of hashes you want to crack in which mode etc.
Thank you for your criticism but I have to disagree with you!
"Maybe there're no answers cause it sounds like you have neither knowledge about rig building of that size nor hashcracking." I've been building all PCs I had until now by myself. I don't have PhD but I am satisfied with my knowledge and good enough to make everything work as it should.
The only thing that I am not sure for and for which I posted the thread was - will the PCIE-speed affect hash cracking speeds with that kind of GPUs and if yes by how much.
"No one is bulding a 20K rig for fun." Well I do. I can afford it and what's more important you missed the part that this rig will also be used to crypto mining.
"That said, as you can read it everywhere here in the forum, this GPU would not be recommended since it is neither an FE-version nor does it have a radial fan."
I think you also missed the part that it will be custom build open frame so heating and airflow would not be a problem. Right now I have 2 Asus Strix OC 1080Ti and I am satisfied by their performance.
I am not looking for cracking a specific hash type. I want to have good speed on all of them.
RE: A bit help needed - Flomac - 12-22-2017
(12-22-2017, 10:23 AM)niceguy123 Wrote: "No one is bulding a 20K rig for fun." Well I do. I can afford it and what's more important you missed the part that this rig will also be used to crypto mining.
Crypto mining on GPUs, well, I thought that trend was over five years ago. But then I sense you want to make money with this rig, so fun is not quite the intention of this system
(12-22-2017, 10:23 AM)niceguy123 Wrote: "That said, as you can read it everywhere here in the forum, this GPU would not be recommended since it is neither an FE-version nor does it have a radial fan."
I think you also missed the part that it will be custom build open frame so heating and airflow would not be a problem. Right now I have 2 Asus Strix OC 1080Ti and I am satisfied by their performance.
You're takling about 12 GTX1080Ti or the equivalent of 3kW of heat dissipation. Even in an open frame that's an issue. Or maybe especially, since you have no control about the temp around the GPUs. In a close case with radial fans on yours cards you can blow a lot of air in and out of the GPUs. That's bulletproof, as long as the room temps are low enough. In the open case though these cards are producing a lot of turbulence, especially at high speed. To make sure that each card is not interfering with the others, is unnecessarily difficult.
But it's not only about airflow, it's also about reliability. FE-models are build for long term stress loads like hashcat. Gaming models like the Strix are, well, for gaming. Their selling price includes a lot of marketing costs and cheaper components cover for that with MOSFETs or the fan-bearing of minor quality.
(12-22-2017, 10:23 AM)niceguy123 Wrote: I am not looking for cracking a specific hash type. I want to have good speed on all of them.
That's ok, but since some methods of cracking need way more speed between GPU and memory that makes a big difference. For most cases x1 is fine. But, of course, if you try to feed a lot of external data into the GPUs with a fast hash like MD5, they might suffer performance hits by the x1-speed.
RE: A bit help needed - niceguy123 - 12-23-2017
That's a much more useful comment than your previous one
Thank youI was thinking to make the box as just a frame and using risers. That way I could position the GPUs with nice distance between them so they wouldn't cook each other and would get nice airflow.
I might start considering the FE-models because of the reliability if everyone claims they are more reliable. With FE I could make the whole box smaller which is also some kind of plus.
Thing is I thought those Strix cards are also reliable, If you take a look at their page:
"Industry-only 100% Automated Production Process
All ASUS graphics cards are now produced using Auto-Extreme Technology, an industry-exclusive, 100% automated production process that incorporates premium materials to set a new standard of quality."
"Patented Wing-Blade IP5X-Certified Fans for maximum airflow and longer fan lifespan."
And so on ....
All this could just be marketing as you say of course.
So you say x1 is fine in most cases but MD5 for example would suffer. Can you give some kind of estimate by how much?
Thank you in advance
RE: A bit help needed - Flomac - 12-23-2017
(12-23-2017, 05:30 PM)niceguy123 Wrote: Thing is I thought those Strix cards are also reliable, If you take a look at their page:It is. I can give you an example: The bearing of the cooler fan. There is ball bearing and sleeve bearing. The latter one is less noisy, which makes a good figure in game tests with noise level 2-3db down. But it weares out pretty fast when running constantly at high temps. When the fan runs out of lubrication you might not even hear it. The sudden stop of the fan will overheat the card and you can be glad if it does not start a fire. The card might be ruined and the manufacturer will usually not cover for this.
"Industry-only 100% Automated Production Process
All ASUS graphics cards are now produced using Auto-Extreme Technology, an industry-exclusive, 100% automated production process that incorporates premium materials to set a new standard of quality."
"Patented Wing-Blade IP5X-Certified Fans for maximum airflow and longer fan lifespan."
And so on ....
All this could just be marketing as you say of course.
Of course you never know what kind of bearing the OEMs use and it might be even fine. But when spending 20k you might be also interested to reduce the risk of such a fatal failure.
(12-23-2017, 05:30 PM)niceguy123 Wrote: So you say x1 is fine in most cases but MD5 for example would suffer. Can you give some kind of estimate by how much?No, I meant fast hashes suffer where you constantly feed them with external data. MD5 with a rule-based attack and a big ruleset will be fine.